Mark do live in a fantasy world? Gov Romney still has not given any specifics on would be policies except a $5 trillion tax cut (not paid for) increase in defense spending to unseen levels, flip flop on every other issue and it showed in the debate half the stuff he mentioned was never said on the campaign trail. OBAMA 4 MORE YEARS ;)

Half the stuff he said is in his book that he wrote 3 years ago. Look it up. The reason he is not giving specifics on his spending cuts is because of the unpopularity of cutting things. He mentioned cutting PBS funding and look how that turned out. Imagine what would happen if he told you that he is cutting the First Time Homebuyer credit. Not so popular for people about to buy a home.

Oh, I forgot to mention why he would cut that:

"And there is more. In a separate study, the Government Accountability Office concluded that in 2008-2009 more than 25,000 credits[$9000 per credit] were claimed by people who reported no income and another 165,000 by those earning $25,000 or less. Care to wager how long it will be before those houses end up in foreclosure? If they were ever actually purchased, that is." -Taxpolicycenter.org

This is a $1,700,000,000 per year loophole. That's 1.7 Billion per year in fraud. Mitt's tax cuts are for $5 trillion over 10 years, so basically $500 billion per year. I just showed you one way to cut $2 billion from one instance of fraud alone. Plenty more where that came from.

@ray andrews..I don't "click" politicrap unless you also include the weekly standard..the middle is the answer

Yes, we need a leader who hides his money in offshore accounts. Moves American jobs overseas. Gives tax breaks that aren't paid for. Claims that almost half the country's citizens are deadbeats. Makes money on cigarettes sold in the US and Russia. And can lie with the best of them. Oh Yeah! Romney is the MAN!

Sure; if you were born rich, white and male.

Make no mistake, this election is about setting the clock:
the hard work today, or the rosy Rockwellian fantasy land of the past.

Obama made this country divided by daring to run for office, and winning.
Look around you, JR - the future isn't pale.

Why do you say Romney "hides" his money? He does no such thing. At least no one has ever proven that he does such a thing. Does he have money in banks overseas accounts? Yes. And that's perfectly legal as long as he notifies the IRS. Don't you think President Obama instructed the IRS to investigate Romney's tax filings? If Romney was doing anything illegal or questionable, we'd know about it.

Could you please elaborate on how you think Obama has divided the country by race and religion ?

"Bobby" As of Romney's 2011 filing, there are overseas assets that he has not yet disclosed, and there are others where the disclosed value is listed as the initial value of the account, and are not including asset accumulation, or other funds deposited
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2012/jul/10/robert-gibbs/democrats-say-mitt-romney-failed-disclose-offshore/

And why don't they? Romney paid 2 million dollars in Federal taxes last year. You paid how much? Please educate us on what more, in terms of healthcare, welfare, security and education assistance that he gets for that money that you don't--and explain how that is "fair?" Perhaps you should write him and thank him for paying so much that you could pay less.

$2M pays for 75 families to live for free for a year.

NK_Voter,
You really want to play that game? Ok, I paid 5500 in property taxes last year. 60% of which paid for a school system that I do not have children in. So I ask you, what did I get for my money?

A thriving community.

A thriving community??? I believe oldtownie lives in RI. By "thriving" do you mean high unemployment and the worst state for business two years running?

Obama says he stands for the middle class yet he has let them get BURIED these last 4 years. Romney paid his fair share and gave millions to charity. Worked for $0 getting the Olympics out of trouble. What has Obama done for $0, not a darn thing. He has been in his glory in the whitehouse spending taxpayers money foolishly.

While Obama was being sworn in, the republican leadership was at the inauguration. As are all officials for every inaugration. For the first two years he was in office he had a filibuster proof senate and a big majority in congress. He needed no republican votes to get things passed. Not one.

Facts count. Got some, with citations?

Spare us the conspiracy theories.

What facts? Over the last 10 years most surveys and telephone polls have been skewed. How come? Because 60-70% of individuals age 18-35 do not have home phones. Any worthwhile survey will either have a reliable cell phone list or will just be conducted in person. Unfortunately, most survey do neither. Also factor in how the family structure is set up nowadays, with more adult children living at home longer and many elderly being put in homes. These important details make for interesting results with regard to "household statuses".

I think it is common knowledge that, with regard to society issues, most young adults tend to be more liberal than not. So when you read polling results, ask yourself: what would the real numbers be if they didn't neglect an entire generation.

So be careful looking for your "facts".

No, he was actually talking about people that use things like the Earned Income Credit

Listening to someone born into wealth carry on about the work ethic of the poor
is like listening to Marie Antoinette give dietary advice to the starving.

This country needs a haircut, just .1% off the top.

Pledgling....you do need to do some research on what you are saying. The fact that many wealthy people fall into the 47% of no taxes seems to be lost on your buddies and yourself. You would be surprised at how many of the 47% are voters. Probably to your dismay

You are so right Bill. Waiting for more slip-ups. Fools use many words a wise man holds his tongue.

So, your solution to a growing tax burden it cutting revenues?

If you think government is broken - that rests at the feet of the Tea Party caucus.
The 2010 election slammed the brakes on a stalled train, still in the station.

The reason? Some of the passengers on board didn't like the direction the train
is pointed - into the future.

"How do you fix SS. when a third of of national budget is going to pay for interest on the debt ?" Two things - social security is self-funded, not derived from tax.
Secondly - if you're GENUINELY serious about debt reduction, look at the DoD.

Do try to be original, Jethro.

@ Joe Souse: I agree with you Joe. People are finally coming to their senses. Whe will the rest get it in their heads that Obama took our $716b without our consent to fund his Obamacare. Doctors that have been interviewed say Obamacare is not good. They do not want the government in the examining rooms with them and their patients telling them 'how' to run their business. My very own physician told me Obamacare will hurt the doctors. I hope everyone is smart enough to draw their own conclusions for the better not four of the same old same old rhetoric and lies.

@ JR

"Whe will the rest get it in their heads that Obama took our $716b without our consent to fund his Obamacare." Have you a shred of evidence to back this up,
or is it another pure line of crap?

Facts count, you should try some...
"Whe will the rest get it in their heads that Obama took our $716b without our consent to fund his Obamacare." Sarah Kliff, Washington Post 14AUG12

The taste is like crow, but it's good for you.

(I know, TLDNR)

@JR

@ JR

"Whe will the rest get it in their heads that Obama took our $716b without our consent to fund his Obamacare." Have you a shred of evidence to back this up,
or is it another pure line of crap?

Facts count, you should try some...
"Whe will the rest get it in their heads that Obama took our $716b without our consent to fund his Obamacare."

It’s worth noting that there’s one area these cuts don’t touch: Medicare benefits. "The Affordable Care Act rolls back payment rates for hospitals and insurers. It does not, however, change the basket of benefits that patients have access to. And, as Ezra pointed out earlier today, the Ryan budget would keep these cuts in place." Sarah Kliff, Washington Post 14AUG12

The taste is like crow, but it's good for you.

(I know, TLDNR)

Tax rates are down, spending is down - where's the problem?

http://www.deathandtaxesmag.com/185847/fact-tax-rates-are-at-a-30-year-low-under-obama/

http://articles.marketwatch.com/2012-05-22/commentary/31802270_1_spending-federal-budget-drunken-sailor

The debt burden is the result of two wars on a credit card and the Bush tax cuts.

Try some math, Joe.

Want meaningful change in Federal spending? How about closing some bases,
mothballing a few cold war submarines and furloughs to active duty vets?

There's an elephant in the room, and he wants munitions.

Let's start with Military spending for a threat that doesn't exist, the CCCP.

What does it cost to keep a fleet of subs churning through the deep?
What's the price tag on the NSA?

There's a blackhole in the Federal pie charts - Defense spending.

You are confusing debt with deficit. Clinton did not pay down the debt although he did get rid of the deficit. Bush added 4 trillion to the debt in 8 years Obama has added 6 trillion in less than 4. also Obama had a big majority in congress for the first two years. He did not need one republican vote to get things passed. He still has a majority in the senate and he has't passed a budget in 4 years. He has submitted a budget each year, and they have all been voted down with not one senator or congressman voting in favor. 535 to 0 4 years in a row. Guess the dems are dragging their feet too.

Katherine, you are confusing fact with fantasy. Obama did not have a "big majority in congress for the first two years". Because of the absence of Kenedy for health issues, Franken not being appointed because of legal roadblocks put up by the republican party, and one or two others, there was only a filibuster proof majority for a total of 4 months. What happened to bills that could be filibustered ? ... they were filibustered. You are also mistaken in that Obama has "added" 6 trillion in debt. He may be responsible for 6T, but that cost also includes Bushes war costs that went unpaid. As for the budget, you are correct, there hasn't been a new budget passed, that's because when it became obvious that there were impasses in the budget procedure the Democrats and Republicans agreed on a budget resolution http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d111:S.Con.Res13: which ensured that funding would be continued through 2014 while they "attempt" to work things out.

Sure there are a lot of problems, but it's both parties causing it, not just the one guy that you don't happen to like.

Rags

I voted for Clinton twice, but his record needs to be put into perspective to what he had that no other president had:

- Cheap oil at around $11 per barrel thanks to a grateful Kuwait,
- Low interest rates,
- The Y2K computer build out which drove the tech bubble during his term.
- The corresponding internet explosion from 1990 to 2000,
- No wars.
- Full employment supported by high tech wages.

Clinton had nothing to do with any of the above. His greatest accomplishment may have been to remain as the Commander in Chief of Fund Raising.

I wish people would stop portraying him as the greatest President of all time. It makes us believe we can somehow go back to those good old days.

William...you say a lot of things that sound real...yet when I read them I see nothing to support ...or at least begin to confirm ...what you say. I think that you know nothing of what has happened in the last 3 years and are just mouthpiecing the talking points of other naysayers that populate the dark side of our political spectrum. To use a cliche......this is a country and culture of all....all...people....just not the fortunate few who bottom line their existence based on what their wealth is. Prove your statements

Goodbye Ri....yep....If Biden can bait Ryan into showing his limited resources...then it is a win for the good guys....if Ryan can stay on script...then ...well....you know....we can lose. Well....I ...can lose. You would probably hoist a cheer. MMMM

Right on the money Barbara!

Spot on Barbara Williams. Bravo.

" Obama his never gotten into the hard work and actual nitty gritty of governing. He has never been a leader, in my opinion, and has no sense of
decency as evidenced by his trip to Vegas for fundraising right after our ambassador and three others were murdered in a terrorist attack which he has yet to tell the truth about."

Baloney, Babs.

Do you suffer from Fox Geezer syndrome?
There's no cure, but the treatment is simple.

Try reading something that isn't printed by a propaganda outlet.

It you think Romney will roll up his sleeves and work on the economy, perhaps you should become familiar with his history, resolve and results.

If you honestly think someone born into privilege gives a fig about us, you're clueless and deluded. This guy will privatize YOUR medicare and hand the profits to his backers.

Sorry Babs....Romney is a tool for corporate America and the eventual flight of capital to wherever they want to go. Romney will not deal with the govt. as it is....a government....he will try to corporatize the philosophy and that is a function for failure. Do you want a used car salesman determining the future of the US? I think not. I fee sorry for so many of you who are hoodwinked by these creeps.

I have looked at his record as a businessman. Purchase companies, sell off valuable parts, destroy employee pension programs (seek and recieve government bailout for same) move jobs overseas (and deduct 25% of expenses despite now pretending he never heard of it) and let's not forget my favorite. BET AGAINST the US dollar. Yeah, he sounds like a great businessman....but not much of an American.

" PS I am not a geezer, but you are very rude."

My mistake, I presumed that someone posting in the middle of a workday must be
retired. So - is the trustfund paying out, then?

It's was an easy to mistake blathering and parroting for senility, where in this case, it's just garden variety idiocy.

http://www.economist.com/blogs/democracyinamerica/2012/01/mitt-romneys-tax-plan

Romney is a non productive financial accountant business man who essentially produces nothing but profits from the evisceration of business...(some of which deserve it ..granted)....His charitable tithing to the Mormon church is considerable...within the defined parameters of Mormon philosophy....but when you actually look at the proportionality of actual giving to monies taken in....well those charities are charities in name only...do some research and find out.

SueR..
I agree..anyone who would EAT a dog must LOVE animals.

Sue don't be silly. Even the Obama hacks stopped talking about the dog after it came out that Obama ATE dog.

thanks Elizabeth

"I think the Patch is pretty far left in their philosophy since I've seen similar incidents. If there is a conservative counter to an insulting uber liberal comment, then your likely to have it edited or taken off..even if the comment were a simple counter! "

This is a well-moderated board that has clear terms of service. Too many comment pages are dominated by conservative voices that gather to have dissent expunged.

The point? Things were different "in your day", stress on that isn't tomorrow.

What you, and other persistent, repugnant reposters of Fox propaganda are sensing is a growing resentment from cynics that don't believe the party line being fed to us from both sides.

Start chiming in on real issues, like the erosion of the Bill of Rights and the gaping maw of the Military/Industrial complex and you'll get your say. Parrot the latest missive from Roger Ailes and NewsCorp and you're fair game.

You're being USED, LRI.

Emphasis on the "retired" descriptor = out of touch with today.

"You can't have a conversation with a Liberal."

Probably because they're laughing out loud at little gems like this;
"VP BiteMe thinks..."

What are you, twelve?

Debate and conversation imply common usage of the same language, reliance on facts and avoidance of fallacy in argument. You might brush up on those, Johnny.

John ....I admire your intellectual curiosity.....let me redefine your last statement.....you cannot have intelligent conversation with a liberal....you have not risen to that level yet.

There are intellectuals in the Republican party, they're just being hounded out.
Olympia Snow, a shoe-in for re-election was forced to retire.

It's an obvious attempt by big money interests to install their puppets, and it's working. http://www.creators.com/opinion/froma-harrop/the-grand-old-party-s-breaking-up.html

I miss Wm. F. Buckley at least he was cogent.

Tiverton..I have 30+ years in the military with 4 + out of this country deployed. How many do you have? If none I'll dismiss you as a liberal leacher. I already work and lease out of state. Just waiting for the wife to accept the out of state job offer to sell the house. All the kids and their families have left out of state also...so I suggest you go to Sectrum India, buy your hemp shirt and head to San Francisco..

...and I'm an Independent..not that it's your business Miss Tiverton.

Mr. Biden is ....and I stress...is the Vice President and he is far more informed than you or I. Your information is based on hearsay from the right wing pundits....his is based on cogent information from our 'national security' agencies. You seem to be grasping at straws.....as they fly by in the wind

Manifold-Excellent!

Mannifold - no doubt obamacare is going to cause our cost of health care to skyrocket..I'll bet to say double within a year..I'm glad my gym membership hasn't gone up too much..it's cheaper to stay healthy---so far.

It would be easy to cast blame on either the admin for ignoring request or the House for cutting funding....probably...unfortunately ...a lot of both...a minimum of resources and not enough communication. I also do believe that in a country such as Libya ...in flux and not totally coherent in its' security....any focused 'terrorist' group could pull something like this off 90% of the time...sorry to say but put yourself there.

Mike..I've been to northern Africa for about a year (not since 2006 though) and you hit right..it could have been pulled off a majority of the time (after doing predeployment site surveys I wouldn't say 90%)..with just that piece of the intell picture known and with their pattern analysis wheel the State Dept dropped the ball..not specifically a single person..but through vicarious liabilty on failed action and leadership skills. There are also other (many other but smaller in group sizes) terror org there such as the AIAI whhich are mostly Somali based but they also have backing..I'll give you an unclassified brief over beer some day..

Leave RI,

AIAI? your joking right? Been playing a little too much COD? That group hasn't even existed in 10 years.

I think we would be much better served by a non network affiliated moderator. Hire from the moderator's union (did I just say that?). Kidding aside there has to be some kind of venue for non affiliated moderators that can take charge of the uncontrollable ticks and fits by any of the debators. Savy?

sorry..line 4 last word = savvy not savy

Just let 'em rip.....show who has the guts and who has the smarts to stand up to the other. This coddled pre-approved question stuff keeps the real ideas and answers at bay....and ...it would be far more entertaining. No sweat on the lips ...just heavyweights going at it.....

I like the let 'em rip no holds barred..either NO, Zero, Nada, Zilch rules..or enforce the one(s) that are agreed to..but don't use rules as a tool to say someone violated them as excuses..yesssss

Fall in New England....takes your pick and somehow it will happen